Monday, March 30, 2015

Irish clergy refuse to defend Marriage (2/2)




When I was a child of ten, I went on my bare knees by my bedside one night and promised God that I should devote my Life to an effort to free my country. I have kept the promise. I have helped to organise, to train, and to discipline my fellow-countrymen to the sole end that, when the time came, they might fight for Irish freedom. The time, as it seemed to me, did come, and we went into the fight. I am glad that we did. We seem to have lost; but we have not lost. To refuse to fight would have been to lose; to fight is to win. We have kept faith with the past, and handed on its tradition to the future.

-Pádraig Pearse




After considering in my first post, the extent to which Archbishop Diarmuid Martin has played a subversive and baffling role in allowing the pro same-sex 'marriage' environment to prosper amongst Irish Catholics, it is only fair to assess how a more influential group have done even worse damage.

It is significant then that the Association of Catholic Priests have decided to finally show their true colours and endorse state-sanctioned same-sex 'marriage', through the most pathetic of cowardly statements.

After a consultation with our members, the results of which indicated clearly a wide range of views, the Association of Catholic Priests has decided not to adopt a position in favour or against the Marriage Equality referendum.

At the same time we appeal for a respectful and civilised debate in which the issues involved can be discussed in a calm and reasonable manner. Sexual orientation does not debar anyone from God’s love. If as priests we are speaking on this matter, we need to remember that the use of intemperate language can cause deep hurt among gay people and their families, as well as doing further damage to an already ailing church.

The ACP asserts the particular responsibility that devolves on priests to measure their words carefully, and not to direct their parishioners to vote Yes or No.

We look forward to a debate that will be characterized by freedom of speech and respectful listening so that the best result for the Irish people might be reached.

The most chilling aspect of all of this was that God was mentioned only once in the statement and that reference itself was a deliberate attempt to suggest that living in a state of mortal sin is compulsive when the urge arises. The Association very deliberately chose to make no distinction between an attraction and the actions related to living out said attraction.




                                                Judas, Patron Saint of Individual Conscience


On what basis would any rational Catholic, let alone a priest, look forward to a debate more so than looking forward to someone experiencing the joy and majesty of upholding the teachings of Jesus Christ, the Son of Almighty God?

Fr. Brendan Hoban spoke on RTE Radio about this topic with words that were so far removed from Catholicism that it is hard to imagine someone on the Yes side of the marriage referendum feigning interest in the faith with as much effort to be subversive as he is. He tells people to look at the issues and make an assessment of them.

Quick look, it's a mortal sin. It's that simple.



                                                             Some timely advice


He also said we don't want people being hurt in this debate. What sort of effeminate nonsense is that? Have they spoken out against the hatred being spewed against Catholics for upholding the Church that he says is ailing? If the Church is ailing, it is because men like Hoban and his associates have no conviction, no desire to save souls. Why would anyone want to join their Church?

In all of our congregations there are gay people, parents of gay people...we don't want to give the impression that we are against people who are gay.

Perfectly happy to give the impression (as Pope Francis often is too) that you are against people who uphold Church teachings though.

We don't want any Priest saying you should vote Yes or you should vote No. We want to respect the rights of people and respect the dignity of people and the intelligence and maturity to make their own decisions... This is a matter for the government and state. People can agree of disagree. At the end of the day people have their consciences and have to vote yes or no according to their conscience, which is the right thing to do... This is not something that is going to impinge. People have to make a decision in terms of what they see as being good for the country or not good for the country. 

Not a single mention of God in his worship of conscience.

Through their indifference, the ACP and Archbishop Diarmuid Martin have displayed their willingness to go along with any and all ideas that society tells them to accept if they wish to keep the coffers ringing in the collection plates. And just like they have for the past 50 years, everytime society tells them to jump they merely ask 'how high'?

And for what? So they can wear cardigans instead of cassocks? So they can speak their simplistic, cliched English instead of Latin?  So they can take their selfie sticks to the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass? To have sexual relations with men and women (and each other) and have society turn a blind eye in delight that their priest isn't a paedophile? A reality check amid all of this, young people hate the Church, older people have drifted away and young children don't even know it.

And why?

Because the Church that they present, that they control, is not based upon Our Lord in any authentic Catholic sense. It is not focused on the Blessed Sacrament or the Sacrifice of the Mass. It has learned to become based on mere survival. After seeing the numbers of those moving away from the Church, they chose a non-spiritual placebo for the catastrophe before them, that was to see their occupation as in need of a pseudo trade union that seeks what is most convenient for their members, not what is best for the souls of its flock. Now of course they are perfectly entitled to be organised to defend themselves, particularly against untrue accusations and dismissal. However, as with all unions of 'workers', it is only inevitable that an ideology will prevail. The most prominent in all this being the ultra-modernist self-pity of the post-abuse scandal Irish Church.

All these things considered,  the most harmful aspect of all these men is their self-deluding concept of going to the margins. What does the Pope or anyone else mean by that phrase? Nothing. They have no intention of converting anyone in said margins, they merely want to give up trying to help them, to give up on Our Lord's teachings. To put into context Diarmuid Martin's vacant indifference to the destruction of marriage before our eyes, contrast it with John the Baptist getting his head cut off, when Saint Stephen was stoned to death, when Saint Joan of Arc was burned at the stake or when Our Lord Himself was crucified with his Blessed Mother watching from below.

 Intemperate language? Dramatic? Every one of you that does not renounce all that he possesses, cannot be my disciple. We must be prepared for the world to turn against us for our faith, if you don't believe that, what faith do you claim to be a member of? Blessed are ye when they shall revile you, and persecute you, and speak all that is evil against you, untruly, for my sake.
Ageing, self-pitying, bewildered men who can not even tell right from wrong. As the Church of Vatican II dies out in this country, with its singing priests and collar-less self-loathing, we should pray that these sad figures turn like Peter did, to repentance. Though they have denied Our Lord (far more than three times), we can never lose hope that even these lost little boys in cardigans will find out what it means to be a Catholic (though they prefer the ecumenical 'Christian').

The words of these men speak for themselves, so here they are, including some bizarre comments from the ACP website, showing the mindset of crypto - Lutheran neo - Calvinists who seem to find their home with these merchants of discord. Enjoy your tea and Daniel O'Donnell albums tonight in your well furnished parochial houses ACP members, us younger generations have no problem doing penance for your souls with the difficulties that your treason have created for the faithful in the years and decades to come.


“Individually or collectively has that triumvirate – the bishops, Iona and the hardline fundamentalists – any idea of the damage they’re doing to the church they profess to serve with such devotion? A positive result for ‘Catholic’ forces (the defeat of the referendum) could do huge damage to the Irish Catholic Church.” - Fr. Brendan Hoban

The virtuous about whom Jesus is speaking are really the false virtuous, those who decide themselves that they are virtuous and who think that if you follow some sort of rule-book and tick boxes about being good then you can consider yourself good. - Archbishop Diarmuid Martin

The Church is in a challenging moment, but it won't be solved by throwing books of dogma at people - Archbishop Diarmuid Martin

Respect for the freedom of others who differ from us is part and parcel of the faith we profess. For these and for other reasons, I will be voting Yes in the forthcoming referendum on marriage equality. - Fr. Iggy O'Donovan (Even Judas Iscariot would struggle to disown Our Lord in such a manner as that article)

Those young priests who embrace a traditionalist view of the Church, they are locked into a past model of priesthood, this manifests itself in the way that they dress up, the way they celebrate Mass, and in their views. - Archbishop Diarmuid Martin

Former President McAleese rightly challenged bishops regarding our lack of experience in changing nappies: our ignorance of the realities of marriage goes way beyond ignorance of changing nappies.  I must be honest and say that I am also lacking in knowledge of more fundamental day-to-day realities of the sexual, marital or parental experiences in a family.
Why then would someone turn to me as a priest and ask advice on marriage or indeed on matters concerning a whole world of life-experiences which I do not have. - Archbishop Diarmuid Martin

In many ways we felt that the strength of the Irish Church was in its numbers.  But those numbers at times hid a faith and a commitment that was not as strong as many had imagined. - Archbishop Diarmuid Martin

It pains me to say it, and to think it; but we may not be far from the day when a significant number of priests and people secede from the Church in Ireland to create a new dispensation – an inclusive church, faithful to the scriptures, devoid of clericalism and fear, free from stagnation and open to the prompting of the Spirit, a viable alternative to the stunted and myopic Church whose sickness is so alluded to in Hans Kung’s recent book. In short, I propose a reformation of a dying model of Church and the creation of a new reality modelled on the refreshing yet unrealised Spirit of Vatican II. I cannot see how, at this moment in history when we can so clearly see demise of the ‘old’ church, we can dig ourselves out of the depressingly obvious scenario of a church on its last legs.

- Andrew (ACP Website Commentor)


There are many who would wish to be led by the hand and told how to vote. And to gather as many followers as possible to draw comfort in their thinking. How so very convenient. My bed is always made for me. My dinner is always there. What we really need is courage to follow our conscience.

I doubt that the God of love will question how we vote but rather the love in our hearts at the time of our decision.

- Can't even be bothered going back to look at the name. Some other ACP reader...

The ACP preparing for May's referendum


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